Comedians At Home Cooking Lunch: Sophie Duker x Saima Ferdows

29 Nov

interview by Saima Ferdows

This is a longer version of the interview Sophie gave for our current issue of the LMAOnaise newspaper, now available to buy in print here!

In this installment of Comedians At Home Cooking Girl lunch, award winning comedian and general legend Sophie Duker opens up to TV producer, live comedy director and comedian Saima Ferdows while cooking MULTIPLE dishes for a bisketball (bisexual basketball) girl lunch. Sophie and Saima met many years ago, working in the same office, later reuniting when Saima directed Sophie’s Edinburgh Best Newcomer nominated show ‘Venus’.

Saima: First earnest question. What inspired you to get into comedy and was there a particular moment when you knew this was your path?

Sophie: Ohh cute, that old question! I feel like I followed a path of extreme reluctance in getting into comedy. So, for a lot of my early comedy career, I'd say maybe the first four or five years, I was like, I don't want to be a comedian, I'm just doing this. I think it was a while before I admitted it to myself. There were loads of comics that inspired me. I remember watching DVDs in my house with my little brother watching Dylan Moran, watching Chris Rock, watching Gina [Yashere] but not really understanding how it existed as a job. Not really having any context for how that would become a career. So, I was like, “hahahahaha can't relate”.

I think it was when the pando hit, that was the year that I decided that I was going to try just doing comedy. I was like, I'm gonna see how that is for a bit and if that doesn't work then I can go back to just working 11 jobs all the time. Then everyone's job stopped, and I feel like that was a time that really stripped that shit away. I was working with Romesh [Ranganathan] at the time, going on Zooms, and his work ethic is incredible - and I was like, this exists as something you can really do! Just being on Zoom with Romesh made me be like yeah this is my work now!

Saima: When we met, you were working in TV as a researcher and then when you debuted, you were an assistant producer. There was a point when you were working on Frankie Boyle’s show as an assistant producer but were a guest on it too.

Sophie: Yeah, that was fucking mad. I feel like people didn’t like that. They were like, what the fuck is going on, I just worked with you on Duck Quacks Don’t Echo (a panel show hosted by Lee Mack) or something and now you're on screen. That was very crazy for me because obviously now I know Frankie better, but at the time he was kind of my boss and then when he said, we should get Sophie on the show, it was one of those things that people say but never actually happens. It's crazy to think that I would be on the show when I'm just a lowly production person.

Saima: As a friend, it was incredible to see. I remember going down for the record with your mum on that day and you showed me where you sat in your office and then took me down to your dressing room - that was incredible.

Sophie: I know! I was like, the call is coming from inside the house! It’s a horror movie where Richard Osmond is like “wait, um, what the fuck?”. I feel like with a lot of moments of being on panel shows for the first time, it was like I’d stepped inside the TV.

Saima: It must have been a bit of a mindfuck as you're straddling that, but it must have been so much easier when you went into comedy full time.

Sophie: Yeah, I think just committing to something is very powerful. I was still like, no I want to produce, I want to be able to do everything. But there are real phases when your focus has to be in a certain place. And as you know, TV is absolutely wild. But also being – in inverted commas, a phrase that I think is ridiculous – “talent”. Being “talent” is also quite precarious whatever level you're at. I don't know if anyone in the creative industries, comedy industry, is winning and super safe and secure but I think that it was definitely a time when I needed to commit to myself and commit to my voice and the best way to do that was by doing my shows.

Saima: Did you ever talk to other people who went through a similar route, like Rosie Jones, for example, who also worked in TV?

Sophie: We both did the Funny Women competition – Rosie did it the year after me. Then we worked together in Zeppotron, the feeder school like the Brit school for someone who works in telly!

Saima: Which I've never managed to crack. The amount of interviews I've done there! I've been physically in that building at other companies but I've never managed to crack Zeppotron (a production company responsible for 8 Out of 10 Cats, Would I Lie to You? and more).

Sophie: I mean it's a small church but it is a strong church.

Saima: I feel like it's the Oxbridge of comedy.

Sophie: Quite literally in that a lot of people went to Oxbridge. There is a weird thing, the sensibility of people in TV, especially when they're doing comedy – OWWW [Sophie burns herself on hot oil whilst frying plantain and gets distracted] – Telly felt like a place where a lot of boys were swinging their dicks around, but luckily that made me feel really at ease in comedy where no men are doing that ever…

*The lunch, half of which was cooked by Sophie*

Saima: Do you have any pre-show rituals or routines to get into the right mindset before going on stage?

Sophie: So because I did improv, because I'm really cool. I did it at uni and it’s not completely different from stand-up. I think that stand-ups that have done improv are simply better. I think it's such an essential skill for being human in front of an audience or being responsive in front of an audience and I think when someone's set is like dead and frozen it's never as good as when they can respond whether that's with their physicality or with actual crowd work. So anyway, pre-show ritual. In my improv troup we always rapped The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air, so I was used to going to gigs and in my head being like “In West Philadelphia born and raised”. Now, I like to have a sour sweet in my mouth. I think this came from when we did Venus together and I would always have a Candy Kitten before a show. I don't have that all the time but I like to feel like I'm giving myself like a little hit of sugar, a little bit of a spark to go on stage with.

Saima: That month that you debuted Venus, I’d treat myself to a Wispa. I'd have a Wispa a day. I remember falling asleep eating a Wispa once and I woke up to an empty wrapper.

Sophie: I think a lot of my rituals come out in the Fringe because that's when we need the juju most. You need your little ritual. You need your little spell. You need your little thing that gets you onstage. Last Fringe, I was on at a similar time to Kemah Bob, and I was like, let's walk down to the Pleasance together, and that was the single most stressful experience in my life. I was like, this will never happen again. I can't, I need to be in my own little bubble of existential angst.

Saima: Are there any comedians you're excited about and why?

Sophie: Oh my gosh. No, I hate them all. I’m really excited about Elaine Babey. I don't know if she’s super transitioned to the live space. She does a lot of reels, creates a lot of content, her writing is phenomenal. I just think she's so apt and so almost understated with what she does. She's now in a show I saw called Group Chat. I don't know how her talent is going to be harnessed and what she's going to do but in terms of people of colour coming up in a nonconventional way, I think she's someone that could be really valuable to the comedy industry in terms of broadcasters etc, whether or not she does stand up. Whether she goes down a sketchy Famalam route, which is what it looks like is happening. I just think having people with that level of intelligence and authenticity in the mix is really cool.

Saima: How did you come across her?

Sophie: Literally doomscrolling. I was in the same Club as her in Accra, because she's a Ghana girlie, but I was like, I'm not gonna go up to her. I had the same experience with Christopher Hall when I was watching Strange Loop and I was like, that's the cat from Instagram. It was a really long time ago back in the heyday of backing singer videos.

I’m also very excited about Jin Hao Li!

Saima: Me too! I feel like he’s so unique and it's so exciting to see what he’ll create.

Sophie: Yeah, I think we’re looking at Swimming In A Submarine as the first show in what’s gonna be a big body of work. It's really interesting to see how it's gonna grow and flex, and it already feels really personal and really just fucking enjoyable. I don't want to use the word joyful because I'm not sprinkling spirituality or anything, but it looks really fun to be him on stage. I wasn't aware of him at all before he debuted and I feel like that's a good thing – as in one good thing that the Fringe can still do, which is just make someone part of the conversation.

Saima: I'm as excited about him as I was when I first came across Sam Campbell. In that kind of way that I think they're going to change the game of what we know and enjoy comedy to be. And also not to diminish his comedy, but just the sweetest boy, and we need more sweet, kind, gentle boys in comedy.

Sophie: Yeah, we really do. I just think I can't understand if you're about the craft, how you can be a prick?

Saima: Imagine your life is being turned into a musical. Who is starring as you in the musical?

Sophie: Why am I not starring? What have you heard?

Saima: You were too famous at this point. It's a musical about you. Why would you be in it?

Sophie: It would be kind of cool to have it be one of those pretentious West End performances, where a different person interprets the role each night. So, one night, it's Lolly Adefope and one night, it's Athena Kugblenu. Oh, I feel like Sharon Wanjohi could do it. Sharon could play me at a certain point in my life. I feel like she's got a bit of that cool, cute and nerdy. I was thinking Ayo Edebiri could fly over. Get an accent coach.

Saima: I would love to see how she would take on that role.

Sophie: It'd be like Bridget Jones, people would be like “she can't do it, she’s too American”. We know what she's like from The Bear and then it's like, wow, she became Sophie for this role. I think Sharon or Ayo. But Ayo would have to do a lot of training. Maybe Ayo plays old me.

Saima: As a teen you loved to write fan fiction, if you were to write fan fiction now what would it be about?

Sophie: Oh, I think at this point in my life, I would be writing what I never really dared to write at the time, which was real person slash, which is essentially non-fictional characters. It's people that actually exist. I feel like this is now very creepy.

Saima: You don't have to reveal who the people would be.

Sophie: You know what? I would actually write some non-sexual, friendship fan fiction between Cat Burns and Rachel Chinouriri.

Saima: That's so cute!

Sophie: I just think I love that for them. I love that. I wonder what they're like when they hang out!

Saima: The fans would like to know, how does it feel to be an icon? And do you ever shy away from the responsibility of being an icon?

Sophie: Wow! Me? No! Tireless icon day in day out. Um, It's very… I don't... I…okay. So, there was this thing that I heard, this is maybe a third-hand anecdote: Viola Davis said I have to stop being self-deprecating because there are people out there that need you to be Viola Davis. They see you and you're their hero. When you walk into that meeting room or that audition room and you're doing yourself down, you're not only doing yourself a disservice, you're doing other people a disservice. So who am I to tell any quote-unquote fans they're wrong, that their tastes are incorrect. If they think I'm an icon, I'm a fucking icon.

Saima: You are a fucking icon. You're an icon to me.

Sophie: Oh, thank you.

I think that, in terms of being someone that is visible, I just want to just shake my ass on a yacht - that's what I realised, even though I get seasick quite easily. That's what we want to do. We just want to like dance, we want to vibe. We want to have a good time. We want to eat food. We want someone to stroke our hair, we want to cook for our friends. And I think that being someone who is in the public eye is an increasingly politicised position. As someone whose existence has always been politicised, that just feels very apparent to me. Even when I was like, hey I'm gonna drop out of Latitude [referring to the BDS boycott of Barclays, which was a sponsor of Latitude Festival], it's still a process of: I have to have this conversation, I have to educate myself. It's yeah, it's a drag, it's a drag to do the right thing and it's a drag to be active in this shit. [Sophie at this point was juggling cooking three dishes whilst trying to talk to me about serious topics.]

Saima: I feel like I’ve known you for so long, and we’re both similar in that sense, to not do that would be a disservice to your inner being because it’s so within you.

Sophie: I think I feel lucky, I think some people feel icky when they look back at their careers and sometimes it’s that “I needed the bread, I needed some cash” but I feel really proud when I look back at my career. I went and did Laughterama in Manchester and I was hanging out at the hotel with my friend and this girl came out of the lift and said, “I love what you're about. I love all the stuff you stand for, and that you're so kind and we see you” and I'm like, that's insane. I get to go out on stage and have fun, but because of the money I haven't earned, all the people I haven't associated with, and all the things that I've said, I get to be a sort of example of hope for people, and for myself.

Sophie Duker is on tour with her show BUT DADDY, I LOVE HER! from Jan 16th to May 9th. Dates, locations and tickets here.

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